163J limitation at partner level

Technical topics regarding tax preparation.
#1
tr7111  
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When you have multiple K-1s with some reporting excess business interest expense and some with excess business income do they offset each other when determining the deductibility of interest expense?

Does it matter if all partnerships are closely held and that's the reason they were subject to 163j in the first place?
 

#2
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I don't believe they offset each other. I think the tracking is separate for each entity, and you can't use Excess biz income from one entity to allow Excess biz interest expense from another.

Did you conclude otherwise?
 

#3
tr7111  
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No, the instructions on the 8990 seem to indicate the same.

Just seems odd. You'd think for a taxpayer the 30% limit would be applied across the board to all their income.
 

#4
Nilodop  
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I don't see limit applied by business, but rather by taxpayer. And 163(j) is applied before passive activity, at-risk, and excess business loss limits. So if it getsto the K-1, it still may be suspended etc.

For section 163(j), a taxpayer with an ownership interest in a partnership or S corporation must include a share of the partnership’s or S corporation’s gross receipts, in proportion to the partner’s distributive share or S corporation’s pro rata share of gross income, unless the partner and partnership, or S corporation shareholder and S corporation, are treated as a single person. In that case, see Gross receipts aggregation for members of a controlled group, businesses under common control, or members of an affiliated group, later.


Gross receipts aggregation for members of a controlled group, businesses under common control, or members of an affiliated group. For section 163(j), gross receipts may include the receipts of more than one taxpayer. For this purpose, all members of a controlled group of corporations (as defined in section 52(a)), and all members of a group of businesses under common control (as defined in section 52(b)), are treated as a single person; and all members of an affiliated service group (as defined in sections 414(m) and (o)) shall be treated as a single person. If you and a partnership or S corporation in which you hold an interest are treated as a single person for purposes of the gross receipts test, aggregate the partnership’s or S corporation’s gross receipts with your gross receipts. Do not duplicate amounts by also including a share of partnership or S corporation gross receipts as your own gross receipts.


Now that's just for the test of what taxpayer is included in 163(j). But somehow it seems like duplication if the taxpayer can't use the net of all the biusinesses.

I admit I'm not sure. But 7701(a) says:
(14) Taxpayer
The term “taxpayer” means any person subject to any internal revenue tax.

(1) Person
The term “person” shall be construed to mean and include an individual, a trust, estate, partnership, association, company or corporation.

unless those are
otherwise distinctly expressed or manifestly incompatible with the intent thereof—
 


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